Hi All - reading a recent thread on the NH Geocaching Forums - I thought the information was relevent to share. Posted by NH Zamboni the NH Volunteer Groundspeak reviewer, I have obtained permission from him to quote his post here on our Forums/Threads.

Before you say - this doesn't happen in Maine, it won't happen it Maine - It Has! Please label your containers.

And I quote -

"Groundspeak recently received this message from a state police officer (not necessarily in NH) who is also a geocacher. Since the message really applies everywhere I have pasted it below.

Quote
Hi Geo people,

I am a supervisor with the State Police dispatch center here.

The reason for my e-mail is to let you know of a couple issues with geocaches. (I myself am a geocache chaser, and thoroughly enjoy the sport.)

We have had several situations involving geocaches, in which were reported to our dispatch center as suspicious objects, or possible explosive devices.

When we get these calls, we send out our Bomb Techs who go out to figure out what the item is.

I thought maybe you could pass along to everyone in geocache land, customers, etc... that they really need to identify the item as a geocache, and not just a duct/camo taped item that may look like a pipe bomb.

Just last month we had a state employee call in, saying there was a suspicious object planted under his vehicle, that was parked near the xxxx State Capital. He thought it was possibly a pipe bomb.

The item was wrapped up in camo tape, and looked like a pipe that was capped.

I later spoke with the Bomb Tech who responded, and he told me it was a geocache. He said they are getting more and more of these type of calls, as the general public does not know what the item is. In this case, the geocache some how rolled out from where it was stashed, and the state employee thought someone planted it under his car.

I know of three different incidents this last year (2009) that involved geocaches, where we had to send out our Bomb Techs.

I don't know if you have discussed this anywhere in the forums, if you have, I apologize for being redundant.

I thought maybe you could send out an informational e-mail to everyone to let them know that their caches could be found by the unknowing citizen, who might call the police about a suspicious object.

If everyone hiding caches would properly mark their caches, so anyone finding them could see that they are a geocache, this might help alleviate some problems with the police having to respond, and possibly destroying the geocache.

Thank you for your time

Please do what you can to ensure that geocache containers are not easily mistaken for a dangerous object.

Thanks

-Zamboni
Groundspeak volunteer reviewer"

Too Funny! A cache that is large enough to look like a pipe bomb just happened to fall from its hiding spot and roll underneath a vehicle. This is kind of silly when you apply some logic. If you were a "bomber" then you would want to mark your bomb as a "geocache" to keep the cops complacent? LOL. Lets give our police some credit, any suspicious package should be suspect!!! Doesn't matter if it is labelled or not. LOL I suspect if a package was suspect regardless of its markings it would be destroyed and rightfully so. If I responded to a "white powder" in an envelop call, I would be fully suited (HazMat) even if it had the words "Baby Powder" printed on the outside.

I do agree that a geocache should be properly labelled. After all, it isn't really a secret and in many cases it might encourage an "accidental finder" to actually take the time to learn about geocaching. After all, it is all about the numbers, the more folks playing the better.

Too Funny! A cache that is large enough to look like a pipe bomb just happened to fall from its hiding spot and roll underneath a vehicle. This is kind of silly when you apply some logic. If you were a "bomber" then you would want to mark your bomb as a "geocache" to keep the cops complacent? LOL. Lets give our police some credit, any suspicious package should be suspect!!! Doesn't matter if it is labelled or not. LOL I suspect if a package was suspect regardless of its markings it would be destroyed and rightfully so. If I responded to a "white powder" in an envelop call, I would be fully suited (HazMat) even if it had the words "Baby Powder" printed on the outside.

I do agree that a geocache should be properly labelled. After all, it isn't really a secret and in many cases it might encourage an "accidental finder" to actually take the time to learn about geocaching. After all, it is all about the numbers, the more folks playing the better.

LOL. When terrorists start putting geocache labels on their bombs, and police will complain again, will we make a different sticker that says: "This is REALLY a geocache" and then "This is REALLY REALLY a geocache" always step ahead of terrorists. :)

Timely message and when you think about it, an important one. It also lends itself to good landowner relations as well.

The way I see it is if caches are marked properly at least it shows we've made some effort to make anyone who finds it aware of what it might be, regardless of what any law enforcement officers might do with it. We should do what we can to present the game in a positive light to non-geocachers. No matter how much good it does or does not do, if it makes the authorities happy then it makes sense to me.

Marking is especially important in urban areas where there are more onlookers or where caches are hidden near buildings or other sensitive areas where onlookers could make easy assumptions.

Cachers have been fined when their caches have been mistaken for a bomb. Something to think about when you are placing them, and again a perfect example where having permission for caches in these types of areas makes sense. A percentage of these scares could have been cured if only the property owner was aware of the cache, where and how it was hidden, and what it looked like.

I work with many municipal organizations. Now this gives me some ideas.

First labeling will not make a difference unless there is more information to go along with it, like the police knowing where the caches are and have access to the website to see if the location in question is a cache site. This will involve a great deal of time and effort on your part to go to your local police department and explain the sport and show them how to work it and decide what they might be dealing with. Putting a label on a cache container will make no difference with out this extra effort. So if anyone is really concerned with this issue it is up to you to make the effort to make a real difference.

I am in the process of putting together another Geocaching 101 in the Bangor, Brewer area. Because of this post I will be going to the new Brewer Fire/Police station tomorrow to invite them to the class and offer my assistance to bring them up to speed.

Now being in this field all my adult life, I will tell you how a report of a suspicious package will be handled label or not. A response from the Police will be required. The responding officers will have to make an inspection of the location and make a decision on what actions are to be taken next. Bring in the Fire Department and rescue crews, evacuate the area, bomb squad, etc.

If they can see anything that says geocache on it this might bring the sport into mind and they can check the web site to see if the location is listed as a cache sight. If they have no idea what caching is or how to check the sight for the size of package they are looking for this will be useless. Another thing to remember is that these people are not going to get too close, for the most part.

There is a lot more to it but that is the jest of a proper response.

Now, lets see if how many of the pot stirrers will be responsible and do the right thing.

If everyone hiding caches would properly mark their caches, so anyone finding them could see that they are a geocache, this might help alleviate some problems with the police having to respond, and possibly destroying the geocache.

If someone sees a marked container, they might not report it. If the hider has permission to hide the cache, the land owner might not report it to the police.

Geocache bomb scares can happen even with marked containers and permission, but labeling and permission do make a difference.

If someone sees a marked container, they might not report it. If the hider has permission to hide the cache, the land owner might not report it to the police.

Geocache bomb scares can happen even with marked containers and permission, but labeling and permission do make a difference.


That might be a problem :eek:;) I would hope that people would always report suspicious activity and containers. Someone moving furniture out of a house at 2am, even if they are driving a clearly marked "Moving/relocation Vehicle", would be suspicious. Report it. What is the worse that could happen?

I would like to think that all geocachers are good people but as we all know we can be decieved.

Again, I agree that marking a container is the best course of action because it promotes the sport in a good light. We are not suppose to be sneaky or deceitful as geocachers(accept to each other with some of the hides I've seen). Our cache hides are suppose to be placed so others can enjoy looking for them. Permission to hide should never be assumed as well as permission to search shouldn't be assumed. On the otherhand a clearly marked geo-container could be a clear attempt to deceive, the more blatantly marked could be the more blatant attempt to deceive. Even here, on these forums, there are stories of muggles "violating" caches. One must use thy common sense!!!!

I have Groundspeak labels on all my caches, except the two nanos but they have the info on the scroll. I think it's also equally important to fill in your name and your telephone number on the label with a felt tip pen. I'm guessing that might convince a law enforcement person to make the quick call to me first, bomb squad second!

We all have to face it, we live in difficult times now for new reasons. My parents lived in difficult times, my grandparents, my great grandparents and so on. As technology evolves so does terrorism. It's unfortunate that we have to even discuss putting labels on geocaches in an attempt to keep from scaring non-cachers, whether it be the general public or members of the law enforcement community. Still, the circumstances exist that make this an issue everywhere.

So I didn't break any of my RC helicopters Friday, and it's a snow day for sure so I just got 8 more Regular size caches camoed, properly labled and ready to put out just in time for KK's upcoming event! Stay tuned. More fun in the Windsor/China area.:)

So I didn't break any of my RC helicopters Friday, and it's a snow day for sure so I just got 8 more Regular size caches camoed, properly labled and ready to put out just in time for KK's upcoming event! Stay tuned. More fun in the Windsor/China area.:)

Went to China. Went 0 for 6 and almost slid off the road going for the "Town Landing" cache. Just a bad way to start the year of caching. :mad: I'm looking forward to KK's event though! :D

:):):) There are some LEO's on here and some folks connected to LE who haven't been back for a while :(:confused::(. I thought this topic was relevant and deserved being shared.

Some good discussion here. I won't close the thread in case anyone else has some thoughts relevant to the topic/discussion. Thanks for sharing your thoughts everyone and keeping this pretty much on track.

What's a "LEO?":confused:

LEO=Law Enforcement Officers;)

LEO=Law Enforcement Officers;)

Yikes, now that I've had almost a full cup of coffee maybe the "lights will come on!" Talk about a senior moment. Thanks for the help Brad!:)

Lawyer #67 should know these things.:D:D:D:D:D:D:D:D:D:D:D

Lawyer #67 should know these things.:D:D:D:D:D:D:D:D:D:D:D

Why not use "cops?" I know that one!:rolleyes:

lol,,,, L.E.O would be to simple for a lawyer. They only understand "yoda-speak" or for us laypeoples, "legaleeze". They spend 6 years in school learning how to speak a different language. A cop to a lawyer = "Authority having Jurisdiction assigned by CRF 12222222.000000-0778999000 subject to title CRF66666666666-9999999 with exclusion to subsection of CRF 1903 8888888888-999999"

Had you said something similar to that then our lawyer friend would have said, "Ahhhh, a cop."

:)

What's a "LEO?":confused:

Well I'm a Cancer . . . and my wife is a Pisces . . . I think Leos are born in mid-August to mid-September. ;) :)

Glad I was a firefighter, didn't have to figure those things out. But you know what they say about FF's......Lock a FF in a room with 2 ball bearings and come back in an hour. One ball bearing will be broke and the other missing. :rolleyes: :D



lol,,,, L.E.O would be to simple for a lawyer. They only understand "yoda-speak" or for us laypeoples, "legaleeze". They spend 6 years in school learning how to speak a different language. A cop to a lawyer = "Authority having Jurisdiction assigned by CRF 12222222.000000-0778999000 subject to title CRF66666666666-9999999 with exclusion to subsection of CRF 1903 8888888888-999999"

Had you said something similar to that then our lawyer friend would have said, "Ahhhh, a cop."

:)

Why not use "cops?" I know that one!:rolleyes:

Stands for "constable on patrol", right?:p

Well I'm a Cancer . . . and my wife is a Pisces . . . I think Leos are born in mid-August to mid-September. ;) :)

My first thought was the junior membership of the Lion's Club.

I prefer cop. When someone calls me "Officer" I automatically assume they want something! :D:D As for the labels, I buy the green labels from groundspeak. I put a few caches out before that, and I put my name and email address on them. I do not put my phone number. On all my ammo cans I write "Geocache" in big letters. Being locally infamous, I'm sure most of the guys around here that would stumble across one of my caches will know my name. When I conduct my springtime rounds I bring a Sharpie and re-write all of the information so it can be read. Maine does not have the funding or the expertise of N.H. and Bomb Techs are almost non-existent. In fact, there are only a handful of bomb dogs in the state. (We used one last year during a bomb threat at school. Response time: 2 hours) I belong to the ever-shrinking school of "The statistics say that it's probably not a bomb" school of thought. Other than the occasional WW2 hand grenade or the stuff that washes up at Reid State Park from the Navy the likelyhood of a pipebomb showing up under my car is less than that of me hitting the powerball. I'm still driving a 10 year old pickup. I think it goes back to basic cache ownership. Good containers, proper hiding, and proper maintainance typically take care of any issues. Of course that leads us back to the conversation about what is a good hiding spot, but that's for another thread.....:rolleyes: :)

Yeah, I'll get right on that.... marking my nano caches appropriately.