View Full Version : FTF Fariytale



Waterski
04-03-2012, 12:05 AM
Once upon a time there were people that cached because they loved it. There were people that tromped thru the woods for hours with old gps units and paper logs. They could cache all day and come home and log their finds . They could cache all week on vacation and a come home and log their finds. They did not have smartphones, and high tech gps units. They could chase a new cache and be in awe of whether someone had beaten them there when they arrived. They still enjoyed the hunt. Those were the days. There are still people that cache with those old units and carry paper today. WHAT?!! YOU SAY?? There are cachers that don't remember those days. Once upon a time no one expected you to stand out in the woods beside the cache and log online a ftf so they would not have to continue to travel and hunt for it. After all, what is the challenge if the ftf is gone? Once upon a time you did not get a condescending note if you did not stand in the rain, snow, hail ruining your new technology phone if you have one, and the battery isn't dead, to make sure there was immediate notification of your find. I cached with a student last week that did not have that new technology. We are all on one side or the other of this equation. How nice it would be if people with all the high tech equiptment would lighten up with the remarks to the people that don't log enroute and just enjoy the suspense of opening the logbook. Some people have cached this way for years. They all logged happily ever after. THE END. The wicked witch.

JustKev
04-03-2012, 03:15 AM
I've made comment in my log recently about that very thing. Wouldn't have said a word but the person who got the FTF is someone I've known since before we started caching so I claim the right to pick on them. :) Other caches we've gone after in hopes of bagging the FTF we've been STF or further down the line and really didn't care, we found the cache and that was really all that mattered. I like to see people log their FTFs as soon as they can (we've even taken advantage of "Free WIFI" at McDonald's to log just the FTF log before) but an instant log has never been something that gets me excited. I just don't like to see FTFs not logged for days. On the flip side of that coin, as a cache owner especially, I really don't care too much for "FTF edit later" either. I've seen that as the log that never got editted (although not on one of my caches) or, should I say, it hadn't been editted when I saw the logs. We all have our own caching styles and as long as we're having fun, I say "Cache ON!"

Mainiac1957
04-03-2012, 05:40 AM
Of course, back in the day FTF's were not really much of an issue anyway. As stated it could be hours, days of even weeks before a cache got logged. And sometime no one else even whet after the particular cache if it was in a remote area. I am the first to admit that I too like running for them, :rolleyes: and I often will log from my smartphone. Then what always seems to happen is no one else finds that cache right away. I guess I will stop logging from the field.:p Well maybe.....

brdad
04-03-2012, 07:01 AM
The saddest part I get out of all this is when cache finders can not get enough enjoyment out of a cache to find it worthy of visiting in they are not FTF. It's no doubt some cache placements promote that kind of feeling, but to expect everyone to log caches instantly is foolish. Caching was not designed to be a race.

Lee and I have actually FTF'd more caches this year than we ever have. We've gotten 8 so far, 4 of them in one day. We went after them because we wanted to do them, not because we wanted FTF. Most of them were not logged for at least 5 hours after finding them. While we had fun doing those, we actually got a lot more satisfaction when we found a cache last year that had not been hunted for in 5 years. Maine has over 300 caches which have not been found in over a year, as well as about 20 caches that were placed over a month ago available for FTF, 12 or so of which were placed over four months ago. If a person is going to get so stressed over someone not logging an FTF from the field, perhaps they should concentrate on caches others are less likely to be running for.

Another idea if you feel the need to make it a competition is to get together with those you want to compete with, set your ground rules including logging from the site and have at it. Race against those playing your game, and disregard other cache finders. So it's not necessarily who is FTF, but who is first out of your defined group.

Waterski
04-03-2012, 08:57 AM
Yes, we each have our own caching styles. My opinions are just that, my opinions. I was hoping to just put a seed in everyones mind that some people just cannot log in the field. I also think that smart phones may be the reason that there as so many logs that just say TFTC. Comments have been make previously on how that is not a sufficient log by some folks. I personally find my phone not user friendly and wojuld not do much elaborating if I logged that way each time. Kudos to those of you that are proficient at that. My logs sometimes tend to have more blah blah than the owner really probably needs to know. To each their own style. It would be a boring life if we were all clones. Thanks for your reflections on this.

Ekidokai
04-03-2012, 02:06 PM
There are a few of us that have started purposely not logging first to find online. The comments are hilarious.

TeamHorwich
04-03-2012, 06:01 PM
yeah, hilarious...it is not that I expect instant logging, it is just that I might not go right then if I thought the cache had been found hours ago. That doesn't mean I won't ever go, but just not right then. Anytime I go for an FTF, I realize that it is a "risk" that someone else has been there moments before, and that is part of the fun. How much fun is it to run if you are not being chased ; ) But if someone has found it and has the ability to log in a reasonable amount of time, why not log it? More people do have access to technology and have the ability to log relatively quickly. It is just a game, but be reasonable - if you can log, do. (And by the way, thanks to those who have helped me with maintenance over the years...I really appreciate a replaced log, or a fixed film canister or other container....I'm planning a big maintenance run soon, but it is nice when others can help along the way...)

brdad
04-03-2012, 07:38 PM
I agree it's usually best to log in a reasonable amount of time, but at the same time If I'm going for an FTF and going to be second to find, I'd much rather find out at the cache site, so if someone held off logging a few hours I would not be upset. I dislike it a lot more when people do not log their DNFs, on my cache or anyone else's. There are a bazillion logs on caches which say "third time's a charm" or "couldn't find this last week" that have no prior logs.

I did log one cache last Winter at the cache site, however. :)

http://img.geocaching.com/cache/log/large/acf42806-bc54-4dc6-9217-8a90875d026a.jpg

fins2right
04-03-2012, 08:47 PM
I guess I missed this new facet of geocaching. People get upset if you don't instantly log a FTF? Do they have nothing better to do?

Ekidokai
04-04-2012, 12:03 AM
I guess I missed this new facet of geocaching. People get upset if you don't instantly log a FTF? Do they have nothing better to do?

It is not that they have nothing better to do they have made a game around the real game and it is so funny watching them get all upset when others wont play their game.

JustKev
04-04-2012, 08:08 AM
The only thing about not logging that kind of sets wrong with me is if you don't log an FTF more than a day after you find it. Even that isn't life ending but it would be nice to know someone found it a couple days ago. We've gone after FTFs before to find that someone obviously found it earlier that same day and that's part of the fun of running for FTF. We even left a note in the logbook to FinsUp when we were alternating finding FTFs in our area. He said he must have looked funny standing in a cemetary laughing out loud at what he had just read in the logbook. It was great fun for us and him too. What we all need to keep in mind is that this is just a game and meant for our enjoyment. Keep it fun and don't let the muggles ruin your day. Or the non-logging FTFers.

CARoperPhotography
04-04-2012, 08:10 AM
What it is, is that many of us "run" for FTFs.... which means that we spend gas money to run based on notifications for which we pay for by having a Premium Membership. Everyone down here in Southern Maine who runs for FTFs knows each other, and we all know the ettiquette involved. Last week, I ran for 6 FTFs (4 in Portland and 2 in Saco). I had them within minutes of publication and logged each on location with my iPhone 4S. About 15 minutes into my FTF run, I got two phone calls, from local cachers who knew based on my logs that they didn't have to run. To us down here, it is competition, AND we respect each other based on the ettiquette and following of such. There are a few people down here who also do not have access to a Smartphone, to log on location.... so what do they do? They call one of us, and we post a note on the page for them so OTHERS will know. You wouldn't believe how many times, a well experienced cacher will wait all day to log their find even though they a) have the ability to do it much faster, if not even on location b) have thousands of finds, and know the importance to certain FTF runners

When a new cache gets published that I am interested in being FTF on, I add it to my watchlist for a reason. For many of this, running for an FTF means waking up early, or dropping what we are doing, and getting a move on.

Anyone who PURPOSELY doesn't log their FTF for hours, doing it to upset another cacher, or out of spite is frankly, a jerk. I will admit though, that between us runners in SOuthern Maine who all are friends, at times we purposely don't log it, just to make another one of our FRIENDS run for the cache, however, this is something that we all do to each other with good fun and we laugh about it. But for someone who KNOWS the importance of an FTF to people, and doesn't log it quickly just to upset someone else who they don't know.... is just plain rude.

In the past two weeks, I have gotten 1 FTF that was 250 miles from home, another that was 150 miles from home, another 100 miles from home, 4 that were 50 miles from home, 4 that were 25 miles from home, and several that were about 10 miles from home. Every one of those, I logged on site. I even logged the one 250 miles from home on site incurring Canadian Cell phone data charges which are not cheap )that cache was Hurricane Pond, in Delorme Grid 47 near the Canadian border)

For people to use the excuse, "oh, five years ago, no one logged on location" as an excuse, then heck... why don't you still cache with your eTrex and print out the cache listings, and decrypt the clue on the trail by hand? Technological progress has gotten us where we are. If you want to be all unibomber and cling to the stone age approach, go ahead. But you're gonna have to take the criticism from others for it.

CARoperPhotography
04-04-2012, 08:11 AM
It's funny Ekidokai, when I tried to play YOUR game by your rules, I got banned

CARoperPhotography
04-04-2012, 08:13 AM
You're welcome TH.

CARoperPhotography
04-04-2012, 08:17 AM
Waterski..... I don't stand in the rain ruining my nice technology. I either have an Otterbox Defender case or a LifeProof case on my iPhone 4S.

And I always log immediately. Heck if I have no cell coverage, I log via the SPOT on my PN-60w

And I think you failed to mention to anyone else in this thread, what else I said in my note to you. If you wish, I could find my copy of it and post it. But that's ok, most people usually leave out an integral part of the story when they complain. So we will leave it at that....

Waterski
04-04-2012, 09:58 AM
I am quite certain there was no menioned of you or ANY cacher in my posts.
My point is exactly as you wrote. Some cachers do indeed use extrex and use paper and encript the clue on the trail. I know..I have cached with them. They don't have an android and don't want one. That does not make them a bad person. I am frankly tired of hearing about expensive updated technology. You do not need this equiptment to be a cacher. If you have it and can afford it, great.

surfacewarrior
04-04-2012, 11:00 AM
Some of the best day's caching I have had is when I was using my "geomate JR." as low tech as you can get (no maps and on lots of caches only the lat/long and them on seperate screens so you have to tab back and forth) and those printed papers while decripting hint's by pen. actually my first 3 FTF's were with them while camping at lily Bay state park and was not able to log them until I got home 3 day's later.

Ekidokai
04-04-2012, 12:09 PM
Etiquette, importance, a jerk, rude, criticism
The etiquette that is spoken of holds no merit and means absolutelynothing because it’s not part of the game. There is no expectation by normalcachers new or old on when a cache needs to be logged. Therefore the importance of such matters is nonexistent.
So, to complain and criticize anyone that will not play yourgame is rude and childish.

CARoperPhotography
04-04-2012, 12:24 PM
I'll take not of that my friend..... one must apply what they say to their actions, or they maybe labeled a hypocrite...

brdad
04-04-2012, 01:58 PM
Lets keep this civil, it's actually a decent topic. There is no need to instigate or to troll to get anyone excited.

So Chadd, why not do as I suggested in an earlier post - Set some ground rules with those you want to compete with, and race to be first before any in that group. If someone outside your group finds the cache first, disregard it for the sake of your group's competition. Post the rules and members as a facebook group, or even a thread here and keep a tally of who finds the most first.

I think expecting everyone to log from the site is as unrealistic as me expecting everyone to stop hiding LPCs, GRCs, or power trails. If you need to define the game to that detail, it seems the best option is to keep the game to a limited group.