Additional Hints

Some caches have hints....others don't. Some hints don't help until after you find the cache.

How about you? Do you ask for a hint, or additional hints in your log or through contacting the C.O.? Have you had any luck in asking for more?

I have a list of supposed 1.5s that stump me. I usually visit a cache multiple times before I'll ask for help. And if I visit the cache that many times, it's usually important to me for sure.

I've had very little luck contacting C.O.s for help, and hesitate to ask for it. I'm not sure if they lose my messages in e-mail along w/all the logs they get, or they chose not to help. I even had one C.O. tell me that it's appropriate to ask for a hint in the form of a "yes/no" reply.

Others have better luck using the Phone a friend. I hesitate to do that, even when offered. Everyone's busy w/their lives or they'd be out caching all the time. I don't want to bother someone just for a cache....after all... it's just a game. :D

It's funny. Some C.O.s love that you'll do All their caches, and ask if you've done certain ones. It's hard to do them when they don't maintain them. It's frustrating when you want to do someone's series cache and can't because there's one or two that need maintenance. Multi-caches fall into that category as well. I would think a series or multi would have top priority in a C.O.s maintenance schedule!?

So how do you handle it all? Do you just eat it? Do you boycott the C.O.s other caches? Do you discretely rely on the help of the other cachers you know?

If you don't feel comfy posting to the boards...I do welcome contact back channel. Thank you to all that have done that already. There are so many more that still hold it in...don't. ;) If you have something constructive or experiential....share it. We all can learn from one another, so let's do it.

I do not read the hints until after I have searched for a while. I have never and will probably never use phone a friend. I don't generally agree with giving hints on someone else's cache - I believe this matter should be between the cache owner and the hunter. I am not afraid to email the owner for help after I have searched, but I will more likely wait and see if someone else logs a find on it first to make sure it is there. Only the cache owner knows what extra hints he/she would want to give. For example, I generally don't give a hint on my caches until I have the hunter reply to me as to where they were searching, and then I can decide what help they may need.

It kind of sucks when an owner does not reply, I probably would give them at least a month to reply before I would ask anyone else for hints, but that is me. Some owners don't check their mail every day. You can always check their profile to see if they have visited the site lately - if they have, there's a good chance they got the email.

I'm not sure I favor my multis first as far as maintenance. I think I maintain Old470 quicker because it is found more often. Most of my multis don't get more than a handful of finds per year, and less and less as the easier caches get placed. I don't pay much attention as to who has hidden caches before I hunt them so I would not boycott them.

It's just a cache, If it's worth it it will be repaired at some time, if it's not, go on to the next. Don't get caught up in the smileys!

Also, I am not afraid to post in my log if I think the D/T rating is inaccurate, and I also welcome input from finders on the same. It's sometimes hard as a hider to realize how hard it will be for a finder.

On one of Laughing Terry's infamous caches in Waterville, I used the phone a friend option. I had been to the site 4 times, and we had 3 cachers scouring the area. Finally I gave up and called a friend who found the cache a few weeks earlier. It still took us 20 minutes. As for the hint, yeah, I use it. I'm not a really good puzzle person and sometimes I need the help. I always look for a while first. I have an Oregon, so the hint is just a button away. Kind of like good food, I have a hard time resisting. :D:rolleyes:

I will give a hint every time I see a DNF. The problem is I may give out too much information. I don't know how much help they want. I tend to tell people right where the things are. I placed them to be found. The few times I have asked, help it has come right away. When I have asked for help I have spent hours looking and I want a very good hint, like exactly where it is. These things are placed to be found and I get as much enjoyment finding it on my own or with help. The ones that I need help on are probably more fun because of why it stumped me.

I can only think of one that I had to get help with that is really a disappointment. The hide doesn't follow the game plan and the coordinates are off and the CO wont listen or follow up on it.

My thinking is it depends on the difficulty level. A 1 difficulty is placed to be found, but a 5 difficulty is placed to be hunted. Of course, I have fairly easily found plenty of 5 difficulty caches and have unsuccessfully hunted some 1 terrain caches!

Generally speaking, I use Cache Berry to cache paperless. The hint is there, but I generally will look for the cache first and then turn to the hint, if there is one, if I cannot find it initially. If I do not find the cache, I usually do not log a DNF but instead choose to 1) Go thru the logs to look for info that will assist me and 2) Return to look again. I have on occasion logged a DNF when I truly thought that the cache was missing. One most recent was a LPC that was obviously missing. After logging the DNF, the cache owner immediately disabled it, checked on it in a day or so and replaced it. Needless to say, I was impressed.

If a cache is so difficult that it cannot be found at first, I would much rather try again at a later time. I just don't feel that I need to phone someone for directions to find the cache.....kind of defeats the style of caching I do. However, if you choose to cache in a different style, go for it. At the risk of being redundant, it's all in how you choose to participate in this activity.

Interestingly, you mention some 1.5's that have stumped you. I have been stumped by 1's:confused::o. So it makes me think that I'm having a really bad day or the cache placer doesn't know the difference between a 1 and their elbow.

Again, great to see topics in the forums like this, thanks.

Of course, I made my earlier comments with the fact being I haven't attempted any of LT's caches. I should mention that I may want to change my opinion after attempting LT's. :D

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Originally Posted by fins2right

On one of Laughing Terry's infamous caches in Waterville, I used the phone a friend option. I had been to the site 4 times, and we had 3 cachers scouring the area. Finally I gave up and called a friend who found the cache a few weeks earlier. It still took us 20 minutes. :D:rolleyes:

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I like to think of hints as something to help the cache finder find the caches or else they wouldn't include the hint to begin with. I use the hints all the time,I hate DNF's especially if I am on the road and not going to be in the area again for some time.My one biggest complaint are the hints where they say it is near a fallen log. Heck you are in the forest and there are literally hindreds of fallen logs.:confused: Kind of redundant wouldn't you say? I've used a phone-a-friend on a few occasions if I don't have the cache placers number and I am again in an area I know I won't get back to again. Each cacher has their own way of caching and this is just how I like to do it,right or wrong,each to his own.

My only hints gripe is when I finally look at the hint after a half hour of searching, and it says "Take exit 23 off the highway to get to the cache"!
If I need the hint, I should be within 50' of the cache. If you are putting parking information or street directions in the hint, I won't see it until past the point where it's relevant. A hint should be for that close-in, can't find it situation.
If you feel that directions to the trailhead or parking are important for the finder to know, put it in the description of your cache.

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Originally Posted by Haffy

I like to think of hints as something to help the cache finder find the caches or else they wouldn't include the hint to begin with.

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You could argue that, but if they were just there to use immediately, there would be no reason for them to be encrypted!

However, I agree as far as hints on the cache page - use them as you wish - before, during, or not at all. I actually tend to use them quicker on a cache that I don't feel is worth spending much time on, or at the end of the day, when I am too tired to spend much time looking.

It is funny how one cache will have a hint for directions that should be in the description, and occasionally there will be a cache with says right in the description something like "... this is a challenging cache ... blah blah blah ... take a turn at the blue mark and look behind the rock under the pile of sticks 15 feet to the right of the bridge to find the cache.

I've visited a local cache 6 times solo.... two more w/several others and once w/6 experienced cachers. Oh did I mention that the C.O. has told me it's an EZ cache!? On top of other similar experiences...I got so frustrated that I went out and bought a bag of coins to seed..... "You've Found Squat" :D

Improper terrain ratings can make any hints less worthy as well. It's not unusual especially for newer cache hiders to not get ratings correct. We as well as several other cachers have DNF'd a 1 terrain cache in Western Maine which to this day is still rated a 1 terrain, yet you have to climb just a bit to get to it. We spent hours there looking for something within reach of a wheelchair. Other cachers have increased terrain due to muggle factor which is incorrect. I have also seen cachers increase the difficulty level because they thought the terrain was tougher than a 5.

Ratings are always subject to the C.O.s perceptions.......and then further scrutinized by the perceptions of the cacher. I hear ya'......

In my experience older caches that were placed before the ratings were established or more accurately defined will often vary wildly from current expectations.

We also recently returned from caching in the Berkshire mountains in Western MA and found that the prevailing geography of an area can impact the terrain ratings found. We went out on a FTF run on a cache with a 2 terrain rating we got parking to find an 850 foot bushwhack up a 25-30% grade, over many downed trees from an ice storm.

When we were done, we spoke to a local cacher (with 10000 finds) who shared the FTF with us about the fact that we thought it was under rated and she said it was correct as caches were rated around there!

So you cache and learn as you go.

As to hints, when a cache is in an urban, muggle intensive setting, I like to provide hints to make sure finders can find it and be gone without drawing undo attention to the cache.

One of my pet peeves are folks that hunt with only the coords, they do not have the benefit of the hider's instructions than not only would assist them, but also help preserve the integrity of the hide or respect the rights of neighboring property owners.

On the GC website there is a link to Clayjar's rating system. I've used it on the caches I've placed, and found it quite helpful.
http://www.clayjar.com/gcrs/

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Originally Posted by lexmano

One of my pet peeves are folks that hunt with only the coords, they do not have the benefit of the hider's instructions than not only would assist them, but also help preserve the integrity of the hide or respect the rights of neighboring property owners.

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There's soooo much to consider when placing a great cache....isn't there!? That is if you care about its longevity, the land, land owners, and people wanting to do more of your caches.

I always use the hint because I want to find the cache! lol I don't have much spare time and when I have a day for caching, I really want to find the caches. Same with my caches, I really want people to find them. So I will give hints if they ask.

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Originally Posted by lexmano

In my experience older caches that were placed before the ratings were established or more accurately defined will often vary wildly from current expectations.

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The funny part about that is the Geocache Rating System Sudonim pointed out has been around and unchanged since the Summer of 2001! That is nearly a year before I joined. The problem once again appears to be lack of information and/or new cachers too eager to read all of the information gc.com has to offer before hiding a cache or otherwise assuming they know all they need to know. Heck, there's even a link to the GCRS right on the cache submission page! I try to remember to link to the GCRS in any cache log where I might disagree with the rating. Education is key!

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Originally Posted by lexmano

One of my pet peeves are folks that hunt with only the coords, they do not have the benefit of the hider's instructions than not only would assist them, but also help preserve the integrity of the hide or respect the rights of neighboring property owners.

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I used to cache this way, mainly because it is funner to cache without any information most of the time. Sometimes half the fun is just finding the parking area. Unfortunately, especially now that there are so many caches in critical areas, there are the property issues as well as others that you mentioned in your post, so I usually will read the description ahead of time.

[QUOTE Sometimes half the fun is just finding the parking area. [/QUOTE]

I prefer to have parking coordinates if they are available. With the cost of gas it sure helps instead of driving all over creation looking for a place to park.

I prefer parking coords to avoid complications. I don't mind exploring and learning about the area. What I don't like is assuming I have the right spot...only to learn on the way out that it's private property. In most cases....having the full listing helps to prevent much of it. You can't assume that everyone will have a printout...or an expensive GPS w/descriptions.

I'm a bean spiller! Ask me for a hint and I'll tell you right where it is. Especially if my intention was to get you to a specific spot. If my intention was to trick you with a well hidden cache, I am more frugal with my hints.