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Thread: Night Cache Placement Guidelines?

  1. #11
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    Well, they both are big and metal.
    I have no enemies, but I'm intensely disliked by my friends.

  2. #12
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    Quote Originally Posted by CARoperPhotography View Post
    I doubt that many if all GRCs would be banned if a cacher got hit by a car... remember, cachers assume all risk and liability for seeking a cache. So... using your point, then could we say that if a cacher has a tree fall on him deep in the woods while seeking one your Brdad's caches, then all ammo cans deep in the woods will be banned?

    There are instances in any placement, that there is the chance that someone will get hurt seeking that cache, minor injury or serious injury and I don't think that Groundspeak would outlaw a certain type of hide due to injury or accident. If this was so, they wouldn't allow caches such as my GC21KNP , or the recently published GC28N8G.

    What about when a cacher who is seeking a water access only cache via kayak has his boat capsize and dies? Will Groundspeak outlaw any caches that you need a boat to get to GZ? Doubtful. Sorry but your logic doesn't hold up.

    And as far as comparing guardrails and F-16s, there is no comparison so don't even start...
    My logic is fine. You are misunderstanding who would be banning them. Gc.com would not ban them. Recently a cacher fell off a cliff and died, gc.com did not ban all cliff caches. It would be the DOT/State/Town/Other governing body that would ban them, or at minimal require approval for each individual one. Gc.com rarely explicitly bans caching from any location, and even then they allow for exceptions. However, there are many cases where landowners have banned all caches on their property when one or two caches create problems.

    The F-16 part was more of a joke, but an example nonetheless. But the truth is there is very little our taxes pay for that we have full rights to. Heck, the gov't tries to control everything we buy for ourselves! They'd like to tell us what to eat and what time of day to take a crap. But that's a topic for another thread - another site actually.

    Funny story - once on a trip to NH we passed an area where a guy had a small SUV with a small trailer behind it, parked next to a guardrail near a steep bank protected by a retaining wall of ragged rocks about a foot or so long. Well, this guy was taking the rocks and loading them in his trailer! I bet he had 3/4 ton worth on the trailer when we went by. I'm sure he figured his taxes paid for them and he wanted his share. Live Free or Die, but I bet the NH DOT would not be happy about it!
    Last edited by brdad; 05-26-2010 at 05:41 AM.
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  3. #13
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    There must be some type of regulation on what we can put on public property such as guard rails. The case could be that you may want to put tupperware and someone else may want to put ....old telephones, chairs, picture frames, dog food bowls, or whatever. How much can a guardrail hold?? Is it just first come, first served? I guess that some people may consider our tupperware and caches the same a dumping anything else special to their own hearts.
    (That person may be Mr. DOT) Just a drivial thought..
    "Always remember that you are unique, just like everyone else."

  4. #14
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    Quote Originally Posted by Waterski View Post
    How much can a guardrail hold?
    I accept this challenge!
    Moo

  5. #15
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    Quote Originally Posted by CARoperPhotography View Post
    Aren't guardrails put in place by the government, more specifically public works departments, and owned and maintained by them? And come to think of it, the towns own the right of way several feet on the side of public roads hence making these all public property, open to caches without having written permission of a property owner?
    Just because we write the checks doesn't mean that all public property is allowed for caching. Military installations, railroad right of ways (some publicly owned) and national parks are explicitly forbidden for cache placement. Other areas may be allowed, but, like it or not, part of our check pays for land managers who make that decision.

  6. #16
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    Quote Originally Posted by CARoperPhotography View Post
    Aren't guardrails put in place by the government, more specifically public works departments, and owned and maintained by them? And come to think of it, the towns own the right of way several feet on the side of public roads hence making these all public property, open to caches without having written permission of a property owner?
    I think Dubord would be the best person to comment on this, but from my experience, a "right of way" is not ownership. It only allows access for a specific purpose, like maintaining a road or powerline. The property owner still OWNS the land.

    I researched this several years ago when people were digging up flowers along the road near my house, and using the argument that it was "public property". WRONG! I still own the land. The town has a right of way to maintain a road, but no other use. The town DOES NOT own the land, and it IS NOT public property.



    (But I agree that I would not feel the need to ask permission to place a GRC, a cache on a power line right of way, or in a rest area open to public access.)

  7. #17
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    Quote Originally Posted by WhereRWe? View Post
    I think Dubord would be the best person to comment on this, but from my experience, a "right of way" is not ownership. It only allows access for a specific purpose, like maintaining a road or powerline. The property owner still OWNS the land.

    I researched this several years ago when people were digging up flowers along the road near my house, and using the argument that it was "public property". WRONG! I still own the land. The town has a right of way to maintain a road, but no other use. The town DOES NOT own the land, and it IS NOT public property.



    (But I agree that I would not feel the need to ask permission to place a GRC, a cache on a power line right of way, or in a rest area open to public access.)
    And the town still "lets" you pay property taxes on the right of way portion

  8. #18

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    Quote Originally Posted by Sudonim View Post
    Just because we write the checks doesn't mean that all public property is allowed for caching. Military installations, railroad right of ways (some publicly owned) and national parks are explicitly forbidden for cache placement. Other areas may be allowed, but, like it or not, part of our check pays for land managers who make that decision.
    I did not say that just because we write the check all public property should be open to caching... however It damn well should be! I also think that if the public actually had access to see openly what the government actually spent (and wasted) our hard earned money on, there would be a revolt in this country. Not to get onto a political rant here, but ladies and gentlemen, the Government in the United States is downright evil and they have no respect for you and I.

  9. #19

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    Quote Originally Posted by Sudonim View Post
    And the town still "lets" you pay property taxes on the right of way portion
    And the town expects you to clear that right of way portion of snow and not put it in the road....

  10. #20
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    Quote Originally Posted by WhereRWe? View Post
    I think Dubord would be the best person to comment on this, but from my experience, a "right of way" is not ownership. It only allows access for a specific purpose, like maintaining a road or powerline. The property owner still OWNS the land.

    I researched this several years ago when people were digging up flowers along the road near my house, and using the argument that it was "public property". WRONG! I still own the land. The town has a right of way to maintain a road, but no other use. The town DOES NOT own the land, and it IS NOT public property.
    I found the opposite a few years back while having my property surveyed. Even though it was a rural side road, it used to be Route 9 so setback from the center of the road was further than expected - 50 or 60 feet I think (State routes have more setback than town roads). And it was on that line that my property started. Perhaps on some rural roads that setback is small enough that it only covers a foot or two off the edge of the road.

    I also remember some controversy a few years back regarding roadside memorials and who owned the land they were put upon, not sure what was decided there.

    In many cases it probably comes down to who has the better lawyer.
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